It’s a constant surprise to me how many people find this Blog after putting in the search term “drum carder”. There is never a day goes by when someone hasn’t found me using that. I have no way of knowing if people are in the UK or not so can’t break it down geographically.
However,from the emails I’ve had off Blog there seems to be a huge demand in the UK for a really good fine drum carder similar to the Pat Green Debs Deluxe but made over here. Can I help? Do I know someone who makes them? These are regular questions.
Why isn’t there some enterprising bod making a fine drum carder in Britain? In fact, apart from Hedgehog Equipment in Wales, (www.hedgehogequipment.co.uk) there appears to be no one making any kind of drum carder let alone a fine one. Martin Hill makes English combs – but what about small hand held combs? Again, no one seems to be making them.
I don’t really understand this. We have superb British wood workers and beautiful woods of all types growing here in abundance, plus of course, a buying public ready and desperate to buy!!! does anyone have any ideas why this should be so?
Home textiles are experiencing such an exciting resurgence that we don’t realize how many people in the wide world don’t care at *all*!
It is true that a lot of the folks spinning and weaving and knitting are artists with disposable income, but just think of the modern equivalent of the cottager (like me, a pensioner living alone in a small city apartment) and what percentage of that person’s income would be consumed by the least expensive drum carder available! About half my month’s rent, and the same for a decent set of English combs. I’m saving for the combs, because I prefer the look and feel of a combed prep. If I knew someone who kept sheep, maybe I’d go halves on some nice prep equipment. But the only people on my little rocky island home who keep sheep work in the Central Park Zoo.
*We* are all desparate to buy, but there aren’t enough of *us* to support a commercial enterprise.
Yet. Maybe when the collapse of Western Civilization is complete…
By: jayne on October 8, 2008
at 3:48 pm
Yep I agree there may be problems with someone doing this as a full on commercial venture but there are plenty of people who do things part time. People who make small wooden items for sale at Craft Fairs etc are rarely doing that and nothing else. David Barnett used to make drum carders (very good they were too!) as a part time venture but he retired.
Some Guilds over here get over the cost problems (and they are hellish expensive – I know!) by buying one for Guild use. Problem with that is how well do they get looked after?
By: devonfinefibres on October 8, 2008
at 4:34 pm
Maybe that’s the difference between a Guild and a bunch of women who meet in bars and drink beer while they spin!
We keep talking about selling yarn online and using the money to buy things we *all* need but don’t *each* need, but we never actually get down to action!
The New York State Sheep and Wool Festival is next week. Maybe there will be makers there we can talk to!
By: jayne on October 8, 2008
at 6:28 pm
Hi Lesley,
Pat Greene and Paula Simmons have spent many years continuously developing and improving their drumcarders, which is what makes them very special.
I find that most tool makers once they have found a reasonable model, sticks to it, perhaps also because they know more about woodwork than spinning and don’t have a crash test pilot at hand…the same goes for many spinning wheels, by the way.
For someone to start from scratch and make something that comes even close to the Pat Greene carders, is a big mouthful. For instance, the question of tpi – that is normally mentioned as a technical specification on various makes. But what about the thickness and length of the teeth, the angle they are bent, and the elasticity of the cloth? All those things matters as well.
Another special feature on the Pat Greene carders is the high and often variable ratio – I don’t understand why other makers haven’t learned from this.
The schacht carder is supposed to be very good too, and is available from Germany – but still, it doesn’t have the ratio of the Pat Greene carders.
Personally I would clap my hands and jump up and down if Pat Greene found a European dealer – but I happen to know there is a long waiting list to have carders from them, so taking in another market is probably too much. They are not getting younger, either.
But I sincerely hope someone is ready to take over and carry on when they stop, and perhaps expand…
Perhaps an idea to send some of this debate to Pat and Paula?
Kathe in Denmark
By: mycraftsdenmark on October 9, 2008
at 12:53 am
Absolutely Kathe – I agree this not easy. I know Jaquie Teal and the trials and tribulations her husband Peter goes through to produce those wonderful technical spinning wheel reconstructions are amazing. But it can be done – The Greens started somewhere. David Barnett started somewhere. I rather suspect there is a person out there who would be ideal for the job and passionate about getting it right – they just haven’t realised it yet!!!
Jayne – spinning and drinking beer?!!!! How do you ever spin two metres the same? Must make for some wonderfully creative yarn!!!!
If you do sell on line at any time I shall be first in the queue!
By: devonfinefibres on October 9, 2008
at 4:12 am
I wish there was someone in this country doing a “commercial” type of carder. I imported a carder from canada 10 years ago. It makes a batt of 100g but would like to be able to make rovings.
I don’t/can’t afford a mini mill (£80K) nor do I want to go down that road. But I want to be able to produce batts/rovings of my fibre to either sell or spin myself to add value to the 30+ fleeces we produce every year.
Denise
By: Denise on October 10, 2008
at 9:11 pm
It’s all down to economics isn’t it, how much time does it take to make, what tools do you need to set up in business, how many sales will you get, etc.
I’m always interested in going into business and several times I’ve sat and done costings. The biggest problem is the cost of premises. There are very few businesses I can run from the limited space available at home. The smallest commercial premises around here require around £7k per annum (that’s all costs, from rent & rates, to utilities).
Re. carders in particular, I have a drum carder, but very few people I have met in Guilds around here seem to have one and most have one, 2nd hand, spinning wheel.
Re. carding cloth – Wingham Woolworks now sell this, so there is a UK supplier for small amounts if anyone wants to take up making carders.
By: Dorothy on October 14, 2008
at 6:16 pm
Hello, I have just put ‘drum carder’ into google and this site was near to the top so I had a quick browse.
My husband has made about 30 carders with 72 tpi and has sold them on ebay. But with each listing he has made, he gets asked for more tpi and a higher ratio. Now he has finally listened and is currently making drum carders with 96 tpi on the main drum and 72 tpi on the licker, with a ratio of approx. 7:1.
We have trouble sourcing carding cloth. Wingham woolworks only sell 72 tpi, and Hedgehog Equipment sell 36, 48, 72, 96 and 180 tpi. We were hoping to use 128 tpi but can only get this from America and the delivery and import tax would be too much money for us to gamble at the moment , as we have a young family.
If anyone has any suggestions as to what cloth we should use or any other requirements please let me know.
One of these carders should be on Ebay tomorrow if anyone wants to take a look.
He has designed these carders around me really, as I dabble with spinning now and then, trying to teach myself. I wanted to prepare the fleece myself, to get more satisfaction out of the end product. I didn’t really like the mess that carding makes, as I was doing this on our dining table! so I asked him to make me a carder that collects the dirt that normally gets left under the carder. He came up with a drawer that collects most of the dirt, which made me happy. We put this carder on Ebay to see if there was any interest in it, and it sold, straight away. Any comments on this would appreicated, as he enjoys making these and there does seem to be a demand for them. Many thanks.
By: ALLISON on November 26, 2008
at 2:38 pm
I got here by googling on drum carder too! I’m thinking about buying one and have just started looking.
Fascinating reading your blog, and the comments too!
I have a lot of alpaca fibre to process, but can’t face paying out a lot of money for someone else (with a Mini Mill) to do it. For what it would cost me to have a few kilos processed I could buy a nice drum carder myself. It’s all about value add.
I looked on eBay for Allison’s drum carder, but I’m about 6 weeks too late
Lou
By: Lou on January 5, 2009
at 12:59 pm